These beings are sometimes called members of the angel kingdom and
sometimes called agents of the creative mind of God which go forth to do His will in building all form in the universe.
Even though Devas do not live in the dense physical they create the network wherein the form develops. They do this from the etheric, astral and mental worlds.
There are greater and lesser Devas sometimes called the greater and lesser builders. Many of the greater are considered angels on the evolutionary arc and have passed through the human kingdom. The lesser builders are often called elementals and are on the involutionary arc. These create all physical form that we see about us.
Simply put we could say this. Non physical beings that do not presently incarnate into physical bodies are Devas.
Humans are polarized in the male energy and Devas the female. There are 300 billion greater Devas for this earth
Definition by J J Dewey
Over 4000 free articles at: Freeread.com
Quotes from the teachings of Djwhal Khul and comments from readers:
"deva and human ... the two evolve through interaction with each other
Man is demonstrating the aspects of divinity. The devas are demonstrating the attributes of divinity.
Man is evolving the inner vision and must learn to see.
The devas are evolving the inner hearing and must learn to hear.
Both are as yet imperfect, and an imperfect world is the result.
Man is evolving by means of contact and experience. He expands.
The devas evolve by means of the lessening of contact. Limitation is the law for them.
Man aims at self-control.
Devas must develop by being controlled.
Man is innately Love - the Force which produces coherency.
The devas are innately intelligence, - the force which produces activity.
The third type of force, that of Will, the balancing equilibrium of electrical phenomena, has to play equally upon and through both evolutions, but in the one it demonstrates as self-consciousness, and in the other as constructive vibration.
Both man, and the Heavenly Men, work in deva substance; both cooperate with the devas; both manifest will, psychic quality and intelligent activity as they pursue their work but a difference lies, not only in degree, but in consciousness. Man works usually unconsciously. The Heavenly Men, on cosmic levels, work for the most part consciously. . .
... the devas with whom we are immediately concerned, or with the three groups I have outlined - the Agnichaitans, the Agnisuryans, and the Agnishvattas. They are concerned primarily with the evolution of the dense body of the Logos, the liquid, gaseous and dense subplanes of the cosmic physical, or the three worlds of human endeavor; with the magnetic radiation of the Logos through His physical vehicle, and with the radiatory emanations of the particular Heavenly Man Who is expressing Himself through our planet. Finally they are concerned with the evolution of consciousness 7 in the three worlds, and particularly with the individualization of the human unit of consciousness, and with the vitalization of the centers in the body of the Heavenly Man with Whom we are peculiarly connected.
A Treatise on Cosmic Fire, P 632
"7) Then Jesus raised his hand, rebuked the spirits of the fire, commanding them to cease their awful work, and be at rest.
8) And then, as though the waters of the sea were all at once poured on the flames, the fire ceased to burn. 92:7,8 http://home. netcom.com/ ~mokeeffe/ AquarianGospel91 -123.htm
"43) Behold that fig tree by the way so full of leaves and worthless fruit!
44) Then Jesus spoke a word that nature spirits know, and lo, the fig tree stood a mass of withered leaves." Ch 105:43,44 http://home. netcom.com/ ~mokeeffe/ AquarianGospel91 -123.htm
The Dark Brothers who occasionally employ these elemental forces to wreak their will and vengeance on all opponents. Under their control work sometimes the elementals of the earth plane, the gnomes and the elemental essence as found in evil form, some of the brownies, and the fairy folk of colors brown, gray and somber-hued. They cannot control the devas of high development, nor the fairies of colors blue, green and yellow, though a few of the red fairies can be made to work under their direction. The water elementals (though riot the sprites or sylphs) move on occasion to their assistance, and in the control of these forces of involution they at times damage the furtherance of our work." DK
The Dark Brotherhood
It seems that the Devas are the female aspect of God, the Mother also like the invisible forces, until they are used or directed to "build" substance out of consciousness or Purpose/vibration.
These Devas probably go in and out of the cycles also or can be contacted, depending on which Ray is more dominant, I only assume this because varying souls go in and out of incarnation depending on which Ray is working through the Earth in each cycle etc.
The Seventh Ray devas are violet, which I think works through the higher third eye chakra, but also through the lower sacral centre, and because we have a double energy of the Seventh Ray manifesting now, then both of the devic lives can be utilized, I guess in this cycle, which does not come around very often.
We have a lower self and a higher self, and the Devic lives also seem to be either lower or higher, and this is why the Brotherhood of Light want humanity to uplift their eyes to Soul, because this is where the higher devas exist also and in which can serve and help humanity much more than the lower devas can.
Ruth:
deva–derived from the Sanskrit root div meaning to shine or become bright. A deva is therefore a "shining one." The word is used to refer to God, a god or any exalted personality. The female version is
1-3. The Blessed Lord said: Fearlessness, purity of temperament, steadfastness in the Yoga of Knowledge, giving, self-control, sacrifice, the study of Scripture, askesis, candour and straightforwardness , harmlessness, truth, absence of wrath, self-denial, calm, absence of fault-finding, compassion to all beings, absence of greed, gentleness, modesty, freedom from restlessness, energy, forgiveness, patience, cleanness, absence of envy and pride - these are the wealth of the man born into the DEVA nature. (...)
5. The Daivic qualities lead towards liberation, the Asuric towards bondage. Grieve not, thou art born in the DEVA-nature, O Pandava.
6. There are two creations of beings in this material world, the DAIVIC and the Asuric; the DAIVIC hath been described at length: hear from Me, O Partha, the Asuric. (The Bhagavad Gita, Ch. XVI Deva and Asura) http://intyoga. online.fr/ bg_16.htm
Deva -- Angel or celestial being belonging to a kingdom in nature evolving parallel to humanity, and ranging from sub-human elementals to super-human beings on a level with a planetary logos. They are the `active builders', working intelligently with substance to create all the forms we see, including the mental, emotional and physical bodies of humanity. http://www.esoteric -philosophy. net/glossary. html
(Sanskrit; Pâli, bright, shining). A god or supernatural being, normally resident in one of the numerous heavens and reborn there as the result of good karma. Buddhism inherited the vedic concept of a pantheon of gods, originally 33, but which rapidly expanded in number. The gods are thought to reside on or over Mt. Meru, the cosmic mountain, and to be frequent visitors to the human world, especially to hear the Buddha's teachings. Offerings and sacrifices are made to the gods, and they may be appealed to for help or protection. They enjoy lifespans of hundreds of thousands of years, but are eventually reborn when their good karma is exhausted, and are thus (in contrast to the Buddha) still within the realm of saṃsâra. http://www.answers. com/topic/ deva-religion- in-encyclopedia
"If these remarks are rightly apprehended, some understanding will come of what
is meant when the deva evolution is spoken of as being a "parallel evolution" to that of man.
In the three worlds the two lines of evolution parallel each
other, and must not be consciously one.
In the planes of the Triad they are known as a unity, producing the Divine Hermaphrodite, or the Heavenly Man - the
self-conscious human units embodying the three aspects of divinity, while the
conscious deva units embody the divine attributes." DK
Man = Self-conscious, God-Man or Hu-Man.
Deva/elementals = Not "self conscious", only conscious of intelligence or the Mother aspect of God/Matter.
Deva evolution (lower chakras) = Sentient = "that has feeling or consciousness" .
Human evolution
both lower and higher chakras
"that has feeling, consciousness and Mind".
This is why DK points out that: "In the three worlds (of physical, emotional and mental) the two lines of evolution parallel each other, and must not be consciously one, when at the lower realms, because these elementals and devas are not conscious of self, like humans are, until they pass through the human kingdom and become higher entities like Arch Angels etc.
Rob & Ruth:
Rob:
So, science can observe the formation of crystals, and think they know the "whys" of it, but in reality they only know the "whats". Agnichaitans are tiny, living computer programs which guide the formation of all physical forms.
Ruth:
They are the intelligence aspect of the Mother or Intelligence Aspect of the One God.
They are sentient at the lowest realms and self-conscious at the higher realms, once they have passed through the human kingdom, it seems to me.
I am wondering if the Devas are the essences or energies of the Seven Spirits Before the Throne, which emanate from the One Life, as these 7 Spirits work through the Sacred Planets and then work through Earth depending on which cycle we are in. For example the Lord of the Sixth Ray energies were dominant on Earth for two thousand years, so perhaps there are 6th Ray Devas, because they are of or from the Lord of the Sixth Ray, therefore humans can work through these devas and elementals also depending on which Ray is dominant in each cycle.
Which is logical considering the Lord of the Seventh Ray energies are working through Earth now, and this is the Ray of Ceremonial Magic or Magic of the Soul, because it deals with Air, which means humans can work with the Air or Mind devas, or have more access to this Lord's Devas. These 7 Lords are Spirits or in Spiritual Form, so the Devas which may belong to a particular Lord also runs parallel to a human essence or vibration as well.
Each plane of the 7 planes or Spirits? has 7 subplanes, making 49 subplanes, so this would seem that on each of these subplanes of the 7 Spirits essence or body, there would also be different devas existing on each subplane which also works through the 7 chakra systems/petals which are like an originating point or vortex between the Spiritual Breath and the physical form.
In other words the Spirit realm or Spiritual Fire/Breath is evolving on a parallel realm to that of the physical realm and eventually the two meet or cross over to the higher Triad or Triangle, Throat, Third Eye, Crown chakra which includes the Heart and Mind connecting in the Brain or head.
This is how I am understanding this Deva realm.
Rob:
Agnichaitans also have no consciousness or will of their own. They are simply passive and spring into action when they are willed to do so by a higher intelligence.
Ruth:
They are intelligence and consciousness, but they are not self conscious like humans are. They do not work through the Mind principle, only through the Feeling realms.
Rob:
Is that right?
There are countless numbers of them in the human body, and of different grades.
Ruth:
Yes, because there are the lower four chakras, in which have subplanes and on each subplane or petal, there would be Agnichaitans.
Rob:
Ok, I think I kind of understand the above.
But with regards to the creation of form, it doesn't completely harmonize with what science tells us. My mind sees 2 theories of physical form creation: 1)matter-is- formed-by- atoms-and- molecules- seeking-electric al-balance theory and 2)matter-formed- by-agnichaitans theory. How can these 2 systems of thought be reconciled? Is idea #1 wrong? Are agnichaitans like a human being putting a puzzle together--knowing what the end result should look like--while the puzzle pieces are atoms and molecules? Somehow that doesn't seem right to me. But I don't know, maybe partially right. This analogy makes agnichaitans sound like they move conscientiously, but you say they "guide the creation of all form".
Ruth:
Matter is formed by atoms and molecules seeking electrical balance, and the electrical balance or essences are the Elemental and Deva substances which work through the Fire Principle of the Holy Spirit etc.
The reconciliation or restoration of Science and Spirituality is via Electricity or Fire being recognized as part of Soul or as Soul.
Rob:
What relationship do agnichaitans have with atoms?
Atoms are supposed to have a life and will of their own, but your explanations makes them sound passive while the agnichaitans are the active ones putting them together into cohesive combinations. Is that right? And yet, agnichaitans are supposed to be passive with no will of their own, doing the will of higher intelligences without question. How to reconcile?
Ruth:
As DK says, "Devas or elementals see sounds and hear colors". When you really ponder on that reality and that "Man sees colors and hear sounds", then it makes it more realistic as to why things are reversed.
This is why it is stipulated that symbols are the way or go between Devas and humans. Devas recognize symbols or the symbols are like the midway point of Soul, through which both hierarchies can achieve some sort of recognition with each other.
For example, the Masons were like the builders, because if you look at all the symbols used, rather than sound and colors in their temples etc, i.e. Joseph Smith and the symbols he used in his buildings, and why fire descended upon the Temple that day, and people thought it was burning down, was because he had contact with the higher Devas of the Fire/Air realms. (Whereas the Buddhists etc are more inclined to use sound.)
Rob:
You say, "Fire is at the heart of all life." You say the originating point of a flame is the heart of an agnichaitan. Would this correspond to a human heart as the most intense point of fire which sparked the human life? Drawings I have seen of Jesus with his flaming heart floating in front of his chest come to mind. Are we just an advanced, self-conscious Deva life?
Ruth:
Good question. However, it seems that there are higher devic lives than human, with the Arch Angels who have passed through the human kingdom and chosen to perhaps stay in the devic realm of existence or Spirit realm rather than live in form. Unlike the Masters who can take a human form and can live in the etheric body. So are the Masters higher devic forms because they live in the etheric body, or are they still human entities who have consolidated with the higher devic lives and the lower has been transmuted?
"Matter is one of the twin aspects of universal life, coeternal with spirit and indeed spirit's veil or vehicle, and hence is present on every plane of manifestation, from the highest to the lowest. When the manifested One of a universe is considered as a unit or unity, it is called the First or Unmanifest Logos; when it is considered as a duality it is called the Manifest-Unmanifest ed or Second Logos, and is spirit-matter or life, spirit being its positive pole and matter its negative.
Matter is everywhere the vehicle of spirit, and in matter inhere the attributes which spirit expresses in it. Hence materialism, in this sense, would define the whole theosophic philosophy."
So if matter is the vehicle of spirit, then the Devas are the attributes which spirit expresses in it?
Rob:
You say if an Adept can speak the language of flame agnichaitans they could control the fire.
You say, "Adepts on the Left and Right use words of power to direct [agnichaitans] , but few of these are in any book." Can you tell us which words of power are available to us to direct them and in which books they can be found? How can one learn to speak their language? Are these words of power sounded on the physical, emotional, and mental levels simultaneously- -like the Song of the 144K? Can one start a fire using these words of power, or can the fire only be controlled after it's lit? I'm not a pyro, I'm just trying to understand.
Ruth:
Symbols, prayer and the OM, AUM etc.
Rob:
You say that nothing happens without motion and fire is merely very intense motion. I can see how intense motion is needed to create fire--rubbing two sticks together, for instance (fire by friction)--but after the fire is lit what is inside the flame that moves?
Ruth:
The heart/heat of the Elementals/Devas propelled perhaps by Purpose, direction, attention, vibration etc.
Rob:
Is my understanding correct when I say that, according to you and DK, all fire is motion and all motion is fire. Since fire is simply really intense motion, then any motion that does not look like flame to us looks DOES look like flame from a higher point-of-view that sees time from a different reference. Hmmm. So, if I spun around in a circle, from this higher point-of-view I look like a ball of fire? Just trying to understand.
Ruth:
It seems to me that our inner essence is fire, which is dim until ignited by the higher fires and the kundalini has risen.
Rob:
Keeping all of this in mind and from this context, what exactly was happening to the apostles on Pentacost when it appeared as though they had tongues of flame floating above their heads? What exactly is happening during a "baptism of fire" experience?
Ruth:
The higher fire devas are ignited via Holy Spirit connecting with the lower Soul and higher mind, IMO.
Rob:
Do devas die? Or are they uplifted, like the human is through soul and the higher programming.
You say physical body agnichaitans can be positively influenced with soothing sounds, music, speech, and the sense of smell.
There is a book called, "The Molecules of Emotion" by Candace Pert Phd, (also featured in the movie "What The Bleep Do We Know?") where it discloses the discoveries made on how molecules released by the brain effect the body. In a nutshell, when we are happy, "happy molecules" are released and plug into every cell in our body, consequently making the cell "happy" and causing it to function better. Vice versa for when we are sad
These molecules of emotion can be released when we hear soothing sounds, music, speech, and pleasing smells. So, how is all this related to agnichaitans? Where are they doing the work in this scenario?
Ruth:
It is all about the vibration of what is sent out. Cause and effect.
The water devas responded positively to being stimulated with positive messages. Remember a few years ago a guy tried this out by using positive messages on water contained in a bottle and then magnified the water after the positive energy had been applied and it was beautiful to look at, but when given negative vibes, the water molecules looked ugly etc.
Rob:
You say eating good food and vitamins provides prana for the agnichaitans which they will take to the fires in my body, presumably to keep them lit. Oh no--PRANA--not another word! But fire is motion and motion is fire, but now the motion needs prana? <passes out>
I think the agnichaitans in my brain have all just died.
What is prana? I know it can come from the sun, but that's all I know.
Ruth:
"Prana may be said to be the psychoelectric veil or field manifesting in the individual as vitality. The life-atoms of prana fly instantly back, at the moment of physical dissolution, to the natural pranic reservoirs of the planet."
Deva
These beings are sometimes called members of the angel kingdom and
sometimes called agents of the creative mind of God which go forth to do His will in building all form in the universe.
Even though Devas do not live in the dense physical they create the network wherein the form develops. They do this from the etheric, astral and mental worlds.
There are greater and lesser Devas sometimes called the greater and lesser builders. Many of the greater are considered angels on the evolutionary arc and have passed through the human kingdom. The lesser builders are often called elementals and are on the involutionary arc. These create all physical form that we see about us.
Simply put we could say this. Non physical beings that do not presently incarnate into physical bodies are Devas.
Humans are polarized in the male energy and Devas the female. There are 300 billion greater Devas for this earth
Definition by J J Dewey
Over 4000 free articles at:
Freeread.com
Quotes from the teachings of Djwhal Khul and comments from readers:
"deva and human ... the two evolve through interaction with each other
- Man is demonstrating the aspects of divinity. The devas are demonstrating the attributes of divinity.
- Man is evolving the inner vision and must learn to see.
- Both are as yet imperfect, and an imperfect world is the result.
- Man is evolving by means of contact and experience. He expands.
- Man aims at self-control.
- Man is innately Love - the Force which produces coherency.
- The third type of force, that of Will, the balancing equilibrium of electrical phenomena, has to play equally upon and through both evolutions, but in the one it demonstrates as self-consciousness, and in the other as constructive vibration.
Both man, and the Heavenly Men, work in deva substance; both cooperate with the devas; both manifest will, psychic quality and intelligent activity as they pursue their work but a difference lies, not only in degree, but in consciousness. Man works usually unconsciously. The Heavenly Men, on cosmic levels, work for the most part consciously. . .The devas are evolving the inner hearing and must learn to hear.
The devas evolve by means of the lessening of contact. Limitation is the law for them.
Devas must develop by being controlled.
The devas are innately intelligence, - the force which produces activity.
... the devas with whom we are immediately concerned, or with the three groups I have outlined - the Agnichaitans, the Agnisuryans, and the Agnishvattas. They are concerned primarily with the evolution of the dense body of the Logos, the liquid, gaseous and dense subplanes of the cosmic physical, or the three worlds of human endeavor; with the magnetic radiation of the Logos through His physical vehicle, and with the radiatory emanations of the particular Heavenly Man Who is expressing Himself through our planet. Finally they are concerned with the evolution of consciousness 7 in the three worlds, and particularly with the individualization of the human unit of consciousness, and with the vitalization of the centers in the body of the Heavenly Man with Whom we are peculiarly connected.
A Treatise on Cosmic Fire, P 632
"7) Then Jesus raised his hand, rebuked the spirits of the fire, commanding them to cease their awful work, and be at rest.
8) And then, as though the waters of the sea were all at once poured on the flames, the fire ceased to burn. 92:7,8
http://home. netcom.com/ ~mokeeffe/ AquarianGospel91 -123.htm
"43) Behold that fig tree by the way so full of leaves and worthless fruit!
44) Then Jesus spoke a word that nature spirits know, and lo, the fig tree stood a mass of withered leaves." Ch 105:43,44
http://home. netcom.com/ ~mokeeffe/ AquarianGospel91 -123.htm
The Dark Brothers who occasionally employ these elemental forces to wreak their will and vengeance on all opponents. Under their control work sometimes the elementals of the earth plane, the gnomes and the elemental essence as found in evil form, some of the brownies, and the fairy folk of colors brown, gray and somber-hued. They cannot control the devas of high development, nor the fairies of colors blue, green and yellow, though a few of the red fairies can be made to work under their direction. The water elementals (though riot the sprites or sylphs) move on occasion to their assistance, and in the control of these forces of involution they at times damage the furtherance of our work." DK
The Dark Brotherhood
It seems that the Devas are the female aspect of God, the Mother also like the invisible forces, until they are used or directed to "build" substance out of consciousness or Purpose/vibration.
These Devas probably go in and out of the cycles also or can be contacted, depending on which Ray is more dominant, I only assume this because varying souls go in and out of incarnation depending on which Ray is working through the Earth in each cycle etc.
The Seventh Ray devas are violet, which I think works through the higher third eye chakra, but also through the lower sacral centre, and because we have a double energy of the Seventh Ray manifesting now, then both of the devic lives can be utilized, I guess in this cycle, which does not come around very often.
We have a lower self and a higher self, and the Devic lives also seem to be either lower or higher, and this is why the Brotherhood of Light want humanity to uplift their eyes to Soul, because this is where the higher devas exist also and in which can serve and help humanity much more than the lower devas can.
Ruth:
deva–derived from the Sanskrit root div meaning to shine or become bright. A deva is therefore a "shining one." The word is used to refer to God, a god or any exalted personality. The female version is
1-3. The Blessed Lord said: Fearlessness, purity of temperament, steadfastness in the Yoga of Knowledge, giving, self-control, sacrifice, the study of Scripture, askesis, candour and straightforwardness , harmlessness, truth, absence of wrath, self-denial, calm, absence of fault-finding, compassion to all beings, absence of greed, gentleness, modesty, freedom from restlessness, energy, forgiveness, patience, cleanness, absence of envy and pride - these are the wealth of the man born into the DEVA nature. (...)
5. The Daivic qualities lead towards liberation, the Asuric towards bondage. Grieve not, thou art born in the DEVA-nature, O Pandava.
6. There are two creations of beings in this material world, the DAIVIC and the Asuric; the DAIVIC hath been described at length: hear from Me, O Partha, the Asuric. (The Bhagavad Gita, Ch. XVI Deva and Asura) http://intyoga. online.fr/ bg_16.htm
Deva -- Angel or celestial being belonging to a kingdom in nature evolving parallel to humanity, and ranging from sub-human elementals to super-human beings on a level with a planetary logos. They are the `active builders', working intelligently with substance to create all the forms we see, including the mental, emotional and physical bodies of humanity. http://www.esoteric -philosophy. net/glossary. html
(n.) A god; a deity; a divine being; an idol; a king. http://thinkexist. com/dictionary/ meaning/deva/
(Sanskrit; Pâli, bright, shining). A god or supernatural being, normally resident in one of the numerous heavens and reborn there as the result of good karma. Buddhism inherited the vedic concept of a pantheon of gods, originally 33, but which rapidly expanded in number. The gods are thought to reside on or over Mt. Meru, the cosmic mountain, and to be frequent visitors to the human world, especially to hear the Buddha's teachings. Offerings and sacrifices are made to the gods, and they may be appealed to for help or protection. They enjoy lifespans of hundreds of thousands of years, but are eventually reborn when their good karma is exhausted, and are thus (in contrast to the Buddha) still within the realm of saṃsâra.
http://www.answers. com/topic/ deva-religion- in-encyclopedia
Here is a whole article on the subject of the 33 devas : http://www.scribd. com/doc/5998794/ 33-Devas
And some more...
http://www.coven- of-cythrawl. com/Devas_ Elementals_ Spirits.htm
http://www.absolute astronomy. com/topics/ Deva_(Hinduism)#encyclop edia
Ruth:
Very important facts:
"If these remarks are rightly apprehended, some understanding will come of what
is meant when the deva evolution is spoken of as being a "parallel evolution" to that of man.
In the three worlds the two lines of evolution parallel each
other, and must not be consciously one.
In the planes of the Triad they are known as a unity, producing the Divine Hermaphrodite, or the Heavenly Man - the
self-conscious human units embodying the three aspects of divinity, while the
conscious deva units embody the divine attributes." DK
Man = Self-conscious, God-Man or Hu-Man.
Deva/elementals = Not "self conscious", only conscious of intelligence or the Mother aspect of God/Matter.
Deva evolution (lower chakras) = Sentient = "that has feeling or consciousness" .
Human evolution
both lower and higher chakras
"that has feeling, consciousness and Mind".
This is why DK points out that: "In the three worlds (of physical, emotional and mental) the two lines of evolution parallel each other, and must not be consciously one, when at the lower realms, because these elementals and devas are not conscious of self, like humans are, until they pass through the human kingdom and become higher entities like Arch Angels etc.
Rob & Ruth:
Rob:
So, science can observe the formation of crystals, and think they know the "whys" of it, but in reality they only know the "whats". Agnichaitans are tiny, living computer programs which guide the formation of all physical forms.
Ruth:
They are the intelligence aspect of the Mother or Intelligence Aspect of the One God.
They are sentient at the lowest realms and self-conscious at the higher realms, once they have passed through the human kingdom, it seems to me.
I am wondering if the Devas are the essences or energies of the Seven Spirits Before the Throne, which emanate from the One Life, as these 7 Spirits work through the Sacred Planets and then work through Earth depending on which cycle we are in. For example the Lord of the Sixth Ray energies were dominant on Earth for two thousand years, so perhaps there are 6th Ray Devas, because they are of or from the Lord of the Sixth Ray, therefore humans can work through these devas and elementals also depending on which Ray is dominant in each cycle.
Which is logical considering the Lord of the Seventh Ray energies are working through Earth now, and this is the Ray of Ceremonial Magic or Magic of the Soul, because it deals with Air, which means humans can work with the Air or Mind devas, or have more access to this Lord's Devas. These 7 Lords are Spirits or in Spiritual Form, so the Devas which may belong to a particular Lord also runs parallel to a human essence or vibration as well.
Each plane of the 7 planes or Spirits? has 7 subplanes, making 49 subplanes, so this would seem that on each of these subplanes of the 7 Spirits essence or body, there would also be different devas existing on each subplane which also works through the 7 chakra systems/petals which are like an originating point or vortex between the Spiritual Breath and the physical form.
In other words the Spirit realm or Spiritual Fire/Breath is evolving on a parallel realm to that of the physical realm and eventually the two meet or cross over to the higher Triad or Triangle, Throat, Third Eye, Crown chakra which includes the Heart and Mind connecting in the Brain or head.
This is how I am understanding this Deva realm.
Rob:
Agnichaitans also have no consciousness or will of their own. They are simply passive and spring into action when they are willed to do so by a higher intelligence.
Ruth:
They are intelligence and consciousness, but they are not self conscious like humans are. They do not work through the Mind principle, only through the Feeling realms.
Rob:
Is that right?
There are countless numbers of them in the human body, and of different grades.
Ruth:
Yes, because there are the lower four chakras, in which have subplanes and on each subplane or petal, there would be Agnichaitans.
Rob:
Ok, I think I kind of understand the above.
But with regards to the creation of form, it doesn't completely harmonize with what science tells us. My mind sees 2 theories of physical form creation: 1)matter-is- formed-by- atoms-and- molecules- seeking-electric al-balance theory and 2)matter-formed- by-agnichaitans theory. How can these 2 systems of thought be reconciled? Is idea #1 wrong? Are agnichaitans like a human being putting a puzzle together--knowing what the end result should look like--while the puzzle pieces are atoms and molecules? Somehow that doesn't seem right to me. But I don't know, maybe partially right. This analogy makes agnichaitans sound like they move conscientiously, but you say they "guide the creation of all form".
Ruth:
Matter is formed by atoms and molecules seeking electrical balance, and the electrical balance or essences are the Elemental and Deva substances which work through the Fire Principle of the Holy Spirit etc.
The reconciliation or restoration of Science and Spirituality is via Electricity or Fire being recognized as part of Soul or as Soul.
Rob:
What relationship do agnichaitans have with atoms?
Atoms are supposed to have a life and will of their own, but your explanations makes them sound passive while the agnichaitans are the active ones putting them together into cohesive combinations. Is that right? And yet, agnichaitans are supposed to be passive with no will of their own, doing the will of higher intelligences without question. How to reconcile?
Ruth:
As DK says, "Devas or elementals see sounds and hear colors". When you really ponder on that reality and that "Man sees colors and hear sounds", then it makes it more realistic as to why things are reversed.
This is why it is stipulated that symbols are the way or go between Devas and humans. Devas recognize symbols or the symbols are like the midway point of Soul, through which both hierarchies can achieve some sort of recognition with each other.
For example, the Masons were like the builders, because if you look at all the symbols used, rather than sound and colors in their temples etc, i.e. Joseph Smith and the symbols he used in his buildings, and why fire descended upon the Temple that day, and people thought it was burning down, was because he had contact with the higher Devas of the Fire/Air realms. (Whereas the Buddhists etc are more inclined to use sound.)
Rob:
You say, "Fire is at the heart of all life." You say the originating point of a flame is the heart of an agnichaitan. Would this correspond to a human heart as the most intense point of fire which sparked the human life? Drawings I have seen of Jesus with his flaming heart floating in front of his chest come to mind. Are we just an advanced, self-conscious Deva life?
Ruth:
Good question. However, it seems that there are higher devic lives than human, with the Arch Angels who have passed through the human kingdom and chosen to perhaps stay in the devic realm of existence or Spirit realm rather than live in form. Unlike the Masters who can take a human form and can live in the etheric body. So are the Masters higher devic forms because they live in the etheric body, or are they still human entities who have consolidated with the higher devic lives and the lower has been transmuted?
"Matter is one of the twin aspects of universal life, coeternal with spirit and indeed spirit's veil or vehicle, and hence is present on every plane of manifestation, from the highest to the lowest. When the manifested One of a universe is considered as a unit or unity, it is called the First or Unmanifest Logos; when it is considered as a duality it is called the Manifest-Unmanifest ed or Second Logos, and is spirit-matter or life, spirit being its positive pole and matter its negative.
Matter is everywhere the vehicle of spirit, and in matter inhere the attributes which spirit expresses in it. Hence materialism, in this sense, would define the whole theosophic philosophy."
http://www.theosoci ety.org/pasadena /etgloss/ mas-me.htm
So if matter is the vehicle of spirit, then the Devas are the attributes which spirit expresses in it?
Rob:
You say if an Adept can speak the language of flame agnichaitans they could control the fire.
You say, "Adepts on the Left and Right use words of power to direct [agnichaitans] , but few of these are in any book." Can you tell us which words of power are available to us to direct them and in which books they can be found? How can one learn to speak their language? Are these words of power sounded on the physical, emotional, and mental levels simultaneously- -like the Song of the 144K? Can one start a fire using these words of power, or can the fire only be controlled after it's lit? I'm not a pyro, I'm just trying to understand.
Ruth:
Symbols, prayer and the OM, AUM etc.
Rob:
You say that nothing happens without motion and fire is merely very intense motion. I can see how intense motion is needed to create fire--rubbing two sticks together, for instance (fire by friction)--but after the fire is lit what is inside the flame that moves?
Ruth:
The heart/heat of the Elementals/Devas propelled perhaps by Purpose, direction, attention, vibration etc.
Rob:
Is my understanding correct when I say that, according to you and DK, all fire is motion and all motion is fire. Since fire is simply really intense motion, then any motion that does not look like flame to us looks DOES look like flame from a higher point-of-view that sees time from a different reference. Hmmm. So, if I spun around in a circle, from this higher point-of-view I look like a ball of fire? Just trying to understand.
Ruth:
It seems to me that our inner essence is fire, which is dim until ignited by the higher fires and the kundalini has risen.
Rob:
Keeping all of this in mind and from this context, what exactly was happening to the apostles on Pentacost when it appeared as though they had tongues of flame floating above their heads? What exactly is happening during a "baptism of fire" experience?
Ruth:
The higher fire devas are ignited via Holy Spirit connecting with the lower Soul and higher mind, IMO.
Rob:
Do devas die? Or are they uplifted, like the human is through soul and the higher programming.
You say physical body agnichaitans can be positively influenced with soothing sounds, music, speech, and the sense of smell.
There is a book called, "The Molecules of Emotion" by Candace Pert Phd, (also featured in the movie "What The Bleep Do We Know?") where it discloses the discoveries made on how molecules released by the brain effect the body. In a nutshell, when we are happy, "happy molecules" are released and plug into every cell in our body, consequently making the cell "happy" and causing it to function better. Vice versa for when we are sad
These molecules of emotion can be released when we hear soothing sounds, music, speech, and pleasing smells. So, how is all this related to agnichaitans? Where are they doing the work in this scenario?
Ruth:
It is all about the vibration of what is sent out. Cause and effect.
The water devas responded positively to being stimulated with positive messages. Remember a few years ago a guy tried this out by using positive messages on water contained in a bottle and then magnified the water after the positive energy had been applied and it was beautiful to look at, but when given negative vibes, the water molecules looked ugly etc.
Rob:
You say eating good food and vitamins provides prana for the agnichaitans which they will take to the fires in my body, presumably to keep them lit. Oh no--PRANA--not another word! But fire is motion and motion is fire, but now the motion needs prana? <passes out>
I think the agnichaitans in my brain have all just died.
What is prana? I know it can come from the sun, but that's all I know.
Ruth:
"Prana may be said to be the psychoelectric veil or field manifesting in the individual as vitality. The life-atoms of prana fly instantly back, at the moment of physical dissolution, to the natural pranic reservoirs of the planet."
http://www.theosoci ety.org/pasadena /etgloss/ pram-prj. htm